Urban Meyer

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Re: Urban Meyer

Post by JD » Thu Aug 23, 2018 9:33 pm

deejay wrote:
Thu Aug 23, 2018 8:23 pm
I wasn’t comparing, all I was saying is that Bob Ley thinks this decision was all about money, power and winning games. Everyone thought Joe could no wrong.
Exactly. It’s wins and $ over decency and common sense.

A guy on Fox sports, who defended Urban, actually said this is what sports is today. Why try to fight it?

Really? :shock:
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Re: Urban Meyer

Post by tribecalledquest » Fri Aug 24, 2018 7:35 am

JD wrote:
Thu Aug 23, 2018 9:33 pm
deejay wrote:
Thu Aug 23, 2018 8:23 pm
I wasn’t comparing, all I was saying is that Bob Ley thinks this decision was all about money, power and winning games. Everyone thought Joe could no wrong.
Exactly. It’s wins and $ over decency and common sense.

A guy on Fox sports, who defended Urban, actually said this is what sports is today. Why try to fight it?

Really? :shock:
Sports has always been this way. It isn’t just now.
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Re: Urban Meyer

Post by squirrel » Fri Aug 24, 2018 9:36 am

Redbird CC Fan wrote:
Thu Aug 23, 2018 7:30 pm
deejay wrote:
Thu Aug 23, 2018 7:08 pm
Whatever what was decided or not decided, Bob Ley said it best; it all came down to power, money and winning games. Joe Paterno come to mind anyone?
Paterno helped shield a child rapist for 30 years despite having direct eye witness testimony to the offenses happening inside his locker room, in the hotel at bowl games, etc. There is a vast difference between that case and this one.
Maybe in terms of specifics...but Meyer knew this guy was a violent, aggressive individual who repeatedly had domestic instances and continued to shield him.

While the scope and nature of the incidents have some disparity, neither can be defended, and the mere suggestion that one is less severe than the other is absurd.
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Re: Urban Meyer

Post by oftenrunning52 » Fri Aug 24, 2018 10:28 am

squirrel wrote:
Fri Aug 24, 2018 9:36 am
Redbird CC Fan wrote:
Thu Aug 23, 2018 7:30 pm
deejay wrote:
Thu Aug 23, 2018 7:08 pm
Whatever what was decided or not decided, Bob Ley said it best; it all came down to power, money and winning games. Joe Paterno come to mind anyone?
Paterno helped shield a child rapist for 30 years despite having direct eye witness testimony to the offenses happening inside his locker room, in the hotel at bowl games, etc. There is a vast difference between that case and this one.
Maybe in terms of specifics...but Meyer knew this guy was a violent, aggressive individual who repeatedly had domestic instances and continued to shield him.

While the scope and nature of the incidents have some disparity, neither can be defended, and the mere suggestion that one is less severe than the other is absurd.
Meyer shielded a wife abusing thief at two different institutions without doing anything about it even though he had documented proof of what was going on. The abuse is the worst of it, but Smith was spending university money at strip clubs, charging personal things on university credit cards, having offensive things sent to the office, sleeping with the secretary and filming it, and so on. Meyer knew he was bad news and did nothing about it over years and two different schools. While the analogy might not be perfect, in both cases the man at the top should have done something and didn't, and in both cases the man at the top should not be in charge anymore but was instead afforded way more leeway than should have been given.
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Re: Urban Meyer

Post by Redbird CC Fan » Fri Aug 24, 2018 11:41 am

Smith is alleged to have struck his wife with reasonable doubt to her stories as expressed by her mother. To my knowledge, there were not any third party eye witnesses to support her claims.

Sandusky is a convicted child molester and there were several instances of eyewitnesses who were reported to Paterno where he never took action.

To equate Paterno's actions or lack thereof to Meyer's actions or lack thereof is insanity.
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Re: Urban Meyer

Post by Bballnut » Fri Aug 24, 2018 3:44 pm

Odds Urban gets a standing O his first game back at the shoe?
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Re: Urban Meyer

Post by oftenrunning52 » Fri Aug 24, 2018 5:39 pm

Redbird CC Fan wrote:
Fri Aug 24, 2018 11:41 am
Smith is alleged to have struck his wife with reasonable doubt to her stories as expressed by her mother. To my knowledge, there were not any third party eye witnesses to support her claims.

Sandusky is a convicted child molester and there were several instances of eyewitnesses who were reported to Paterno where he never took action.

To equate Paterno's actions or lack thereof to Meyer's actions or lack thereof is insanity.
Both men were willfully ignorant to the abuse of others at the hands of their assistant coaches. If you believe that Urban Meyer didn't know what was going on, you are sticking your head into the sand. Smith has a track record a mile long of bad, illegal behavior, most of it covered up by OSU and Meyer. It's a bad look for Meyer, OSU, and college football.
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Re: Urban Meyer

Post by Buckeyes1 » Fri Aug 24, 2018 8:13 pm

oftenrunning52 wrote:
Fri Aug 24, 2018 5:39 pm
Redbird CC Fan wrote:
Fri Aug 24, 2018 11:41 am
Smith is alleged to have struck his wife with reasonable doubt to her stories as expressed by her mother. To my knowledge, there were not any third party eye witnesses to support her claims.

Sandusky is a convicted child molester and there were several instances of eyewitnesses who were reported to Paterno where he never took action.

To equate Paterno's actions or lack thereof to Meyer's actions or lack thereof is insanity.
Both men were willfully ignorant to the abuse of others at the hands of their assistant coaches. If you believe that Urban Meyer didn't know what was going on, you are sticking your head into the sand. Smith has a track record a mile long of bad, illegal behavior, most of it covered up by OSU and Meyer. It's a bad look for Meyer, OSU, and college football.
Well the police don’t believe anything was going on either. Again, if the police found no reason to press charges why should Meyer have? I still have not been given a reasonable answer to that question.

His other actions were more fireable offenses
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Re: Urban Meyer

Post by JD » Fri Aug 24, 2018 10:38 pm

Why did Urnan apologize to Courtney Smith today if it’s all made up?

Hmmm
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Re: Urban Meyer

Post by oftenrunning52 » Sat Aug 25, 2018 6:24 am

Buckeyes1 wrote:
Fri Aug 24, 2018 8:13 pm
oftenrunning52 wrote:
Fri Aug 24, 2018 5:39 pm
Redbird CC Fan wrote:
Fri Aug 24, 2018 11:41 am
Smith is alleged to have struck his wife with reasonable doubt to her stories as expressed by her mother. To my knowledge, there were not any third party eye witnesses to support her claims.

Sandusky is a convicted child molester and there were several instances of eyewitnesses who were reported to Paterno where he never took action.

To equate Paterno's actions or lack thereof to Meyer's actions or lack thereof is insanity.
Both men were willfully ignorant to the abuse of others at the hands of their assistant coaches. If you believe that Urban Meyer didn't know what was going on, you are sticking your head into the sand. Smith has a track record a mile long of bad, illegal behavior, most of it covered up by OSU and Meyer. It's a bad look for Meyer, OSU, and college football.
Well the police don’t believe anything was going on either. Again, if the police found no reason to press charges why should Meyer have? I still have not been given a reasonable answer to that question.

His other actions were more fireable offenses
From the OSU investigation: a record of Smith engaging in “promiscuous and embarrassing sexual behavior, drug abuse, truancy, dishonesty, financial irresponsibility, a possible NCAA violation, and a lengthy police investigation into allegations of criminal domestic violence and cybercrimes,” plus another arrest and the domestic violence protection order that finally got him fired.

From Deadspin (and other sources but I'm quoting them): But according to a police report officers on the scene of the incident in 2009 “determined Zach was the primary aggressor” in an altercation with his then-pregnant wife. Smith was reportedly arrested in May for trespassing on his now ex-wife’s property, and a judge granted the ex-wife’s request for a protection order on Friday.

As happens often in domestic cases, parties don't want to file charges or are convinced not to by others for various reasons (in this case, Courtney Smith was asked not to file them because her husband would then be unemployed and unemployable).

Just stop trying to defend Meyer. It's not worth it.
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Re: Urban Meyer

Post by Buckeyes1 » Sat Aug 25, 2018 2:51 pm

JD wrote:
Fri Aug 24, 2018 10:38 pm
Why did Urnan apologize to Courtney Smith today if it’s all made up?

Hmmm
The media lynch mob. If you believe he is sincerely sorry for anything you are nuts.
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Re: Urban Meyer

Post by Buckeyes1 » Sat Aug 25, 2018 2:58 pm

oftenrunning52 wrote:
Sat Aug 25, 2018 6:24 am

Just stop trying to defend Meyer. It's not worth it.
Umm no. Your explanation still doesn’t answer the question. Meyer reported to his bosses in 09 and 15.

It was the universities fault as far as I am concerned. Meyer is taking the heat for it but he did his job.
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Re: Urban Meyer

Post by JD » Sat Aug 25, 2018 4:45 pm

Buckeyes1 wrote:
Sat Aug 25, 2018 2:51 pm
JD wrote:
Fri Aug 24, 2018 10:38 pm
Why did Urnan apologize to Courtney Smith today if it’s all made up?

Hmmm
The media lynch mob. If you believe he is sincerely sorry for anything you are nuts.
Yep that dbag media trying to find the truth. How dare people be against multiple time domestic abusers and liars.

I don’t think for a minute Urban is sorry for trying to lie his way out of this.

I believe he’d sell his family on the black market for a few wins.
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Re: Urban Meyer

Post by Buckeyes1 » Sun Aug 26, 2018 6:15 am

JD wrote:
Sat Aug 25, 2018 4:45 pm
Buckeyes1 wrote:
Sat Aug 25, 2018 2:51 pm
JD wrote:
Fri Aug 24, 2018 10:38 pm
Why did Urnan apologize to Courtney Smith today if it’s all made up?

Hmmm
The media lynch mob. If you believe he is sincerely sorry for anything you are nuts.
Yep that dbag media trying to find the truth. How dare people be against multiple time domestic abusers and liars.

I don’t think for a minute Urban is sorry for trying to lie his way out of this.

I believe he’d sell his family on the black market for a few wins.
You are hilarious. Yes the media is trying to find the “truth.” The media has presented a one sided view of this from day one. McMurphy opened this all up with a half story with the sole intention of making a name for himself again after being let go by ESPN. And that became the narrative the rest of the way. They never touched any bit of the story that didn’t support that narrative. And it appears you ate it all right up.

I don’t deny that Zach Smith appears to have been creepy and not a great guy. But Courtney was not a great person either. And again if you are so keen to think Meyer should have done something I still don’t understand why you don’t have this same disdain for the police departments from two different cities that came to the same conclusion. You can’t go around firing people because of accusations.
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Re: Urban Meyer

Post by JD » Sun Aug 26, 2018 6:35 am

Buckeyes1 wrote:
Sun Aug 26, 2018 6:15 am


I don’t deny that Zach Smith appears to have been creepy and not a great guy. But Courtney was not a great person either. And again if you are so keen to think Meyer should have done something I still don’t understand why you don’t have this same disdain for the police departments from two different cities that came to the same conclusion. You can’t go around firing people because of accusations.
The police didn’t lie about anything. The police didn’t try to cover up anything. The police didn’t claim amnesia from medicine.

He’s an adult man. Act like one.
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Re: Urban Meyer

Post by oftenrunning52 » Sun Aug 26, 2018 7:44 am

Buckeyes1 wrote:
Sat Aug 25, 2018 2:58 pm
oftenrunning52 wrote:
Sat Aug 25, 2018 6:24 am

Just stop trying to defend Meyer. It's not worth it.
Umm no. Your explanation still doesn’t answer the question. Meyer reported to his bosses in 09 and 15.

It was the universities fault as far as I am concerned. Meyer is taking the heat for it but he did his job.
Meyer, at any point, could have fired him. Stop deflecting the blame away from him. If he reported both incidents, and big "if" still at this point, he is then shirking his personal responsibility by pointing at the AD and saying well he didn't do anything. Hell, from his public job performance records, Smith wasn't even a good coach! You could have fired for that alone. Instead, Meyer continued to cover for him. Now Meyer is willing to throw everyone else under the bus to save what little reputation he has left. And Buckeye Nation is still there soaking up everything he says as gospel. It's disgusting!
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Re: Urban Meyer

Post by Redbird CC Fan » Sun Aug 26, 2018 11:38 am

It comes down to a basic question. Should a man be automatically fired from his job based on accusations alone when no charges are filed?
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Re: Urban Meyer

Post by Buckeyes1 » Sun Aug 26, 2018 12:10 pm

Redbird CC Fan wrote:
Sun Aug 26, 2018 11:38 am
It comes down to a basic question. Should a man be automatically fired from his job based on accusations alone when no charges are filed?
Based off this board I would say most say the answer is yes.
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Re: Urban Meyer

Post by CIS » Sun Aug 26, 2018 2:01 pm

I just wonder why coaches stick with these bad dudes. Whatever is true about Smith, it seems that he was a really bad dude with a lot of baggage - why would a guy like Meyers stick with him or even potentially ignore the bad stuff? No assistant coach is worth all that and by all accounts it seems Smith wasn't even a very good coach. And why did Paterno stick with Sandusky or cover up/ignore the awful stuff he did? Assistant coaches come a dime a dozen, no assistant is worth covering up for or keeping. Do these coaches do it because they don't want to embarrass the program (make coach/school look bad) or because these assistant coaches are their "friends"?

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Re: Urban Meyer

Post by Redbird CC Fan » Sun Aug 26, 2018 2:39 pm

CIS wrote:
Sun Aug 26, 2018 2:01 pm
I just wonder why coaches stick with these bad dudes. Whatever is true about Smith, it seems that he was a really bad dude with a lot of baggage - why would a guy like Meyers stick with him or even potentially ignore the bad stuff? No assistant coach is worth all that and by all accounts it seems Smith wasn't even a very good coach. And why did Paterno stick with Sandusky or cover up/ignore the awful stuff he did? Assistant coaches come a dime a dozen, no assistant is worth covering up for or keeping. Do these coaches do it because they don't want to embarrass the program (make coach/school look bad) or because these assistant coaches are their "friends"?
I don't get it either. Why Meyer kept Smith around as long as he did is a mystery.
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Re: Urban Meyer

Post by illini25 » Sun Aug 26, 2018 3:00 pm

It seems as if Meyer was “too loyal” to his mentor, Earle Bruce, in keeping Bruce’s grandson. I wonder how this would have played out if Bruce were still alive.

My guess on Paterno is that by the time he finally removed Sandusky from the coaching staff he knew coming clean about everything would permanently tarnish his legend. Why he didn’t do something before that may be due to denial or disbelief.

Just guessing.
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Re: Urban Meyer

Post by real fan » Sun Aug 26, 2018 8:51 pm

Bottom line is Meyer keeps his job because he is winning, he would have gotten fired if he was losing and would have been fired with cause and lost out on all his contractual money. Too much money on the line to fire a highly successful coach even though he is just another coach that lacks integrity and ethics.

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Re: Urban Meyer

Post by TheRoller » Sun Aug 26, 2018 10:31 pm

real fan wrote:
Sun Aug 26, 2018 8:51 pm
Bottom line is Meyer keeps his job because he is winning, he would have gotten fired if he was losing and would have been fired with cause and lost out on all his contractual money. Too much money on the line to fire a highly successful coach even though he is just another coach that lacks integrity and ethics.
I heard Paul Finebaum on the radio the day the suspension was announced. PF is as connected as anyone especially in the SEC and made no bones about it. Meyer is a manipulative, unethical liar. This wasn't
just someone jumping on a bandwagon it is a respected journalist who spent a great deal of time around the man while he was at Florida.

Meyer's actions throughout this make no sense and OSU's administration makes none either. Read the report and it's pretty clear; they know Meyer is a liar but they just can't bring themselves to do anything about it because their football fans will be mad if they do. OSU has simply added itself to the growing and shameful list of universities that decided the image of their athletics was more important than the integrity of their institutions. Move over Penn St., Michigan St., Baylor and Louisville, the Buckeyes are joining the party.
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Re: Urban Meyer

Post by JD » Mon Aug 27, 2018 5:54 am

That’s correct
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Re: Urban Meyer

Post by Redbird CC Fan » Mon Aug 27, 2018 11:15 am

So Urban Meyer should have been fired for not firing an assistant coach who wasn't charged fast enough? What would fast enough have been for everyone, when the first allegation was made?

It is a very dangerous slippery slope to fire a coach, drop an athlete, etc. based solely on an unconfirmed allegation particularly when there isn't enough evidence to support a criminal charge. Title IX has become a kangaroo court at many universities where the accused is denied due process, and colleges are starting to get in legal trouble for going too far as the number of proven false accusations are growing.
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